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Does exactly what it says and it is so easy to set up that even I could do it. Thank you Val for all the work and love you put into your items.
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Having lived in the real Louisville for a few year in the past, I really like this! Great job on the bridges! ( I actually walked across the old one one time...and once was enough)
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So excited to hear that you are bringing the mall to be Riverdale!
And I can vouch that Hertha will gladly share anything you might find at SIlverfox Designs. He has been very gracious at sharing things with me that I have found around the mall.
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I am just curious. Are you in a sim/server that is running the new lighting engine? If not, that is why a lot of those options are greyed out and why they wont work. It sounds like your water is dealing with "exposure". With PBR, EVERYTHING is going to effect how everything else looks. Your windlight, the color of your water, and your reflectivity, will all influence how everything look. It is called Exposure.


And to be fair, the fIrestorm creators have made it clear all over their website that this new viewer WILL be buggy and WILL have problems. This is a warts and all release and they are not hiding that fact.
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I think you hit the nail on the head in that last paragraph. With Phillip Rosedle back at LL, I dont think there is any desire at all to move down the VR route. He learned the hard way with High Fidelity that that is a dead end and will be for some time. That is why the VR viewer was scrapped and there has been almost zero effort to revive it. That leaves, as you pointed out, competing with world's easily built on top of Unreal Engine or Unity. The "scratch-made" engine SL uses is and has been a huge anvil around its neck and I think they are trying really hard to drag it kicking and screaming to a point where it can near Unity or Unreal Engine. This is a big step in that direction.
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Linden Lab may be secretly working on an engine upgrade. Secretly because they don't know yet if it'll fly, and they know that anything that even remotely appears like an announcement is taken by the community for a promise. But they can't wait until it's done before they roll out a visuals upgrade. They need SL to look like Cyberpunk 2077 NOW.
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And after the windfall they got in the sale of Tlla, they now have cash to burn, so they might as well burn it on SL. And yes, the second they mention it, a LOT of people will be wanting it yesterday. The big question is, can they do the engine upgrade without breaking years and years of people's content? (You will take my prim hair when you pry it from my cold, dead hands!) If not, that might be also why they are quiet about it.
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I think this is VERY important to understand. PBR is much different than the ability to use specular maps in advanced lighting, which OS already has. Adding specular and normal maps to your objects is great (and looks great!) but PBR is a whole lot more than that. As Alexa points out, you have to be on a server that has the capability, none of which I have seen in OS yet. (Not saying they are not there, I just have not seen them.) Along with Norma and Specular maps which we can currently use, PBR lighting also requires an Ambient Occlusion or ORM texture layer and a Rougness layer. Then you (I think?) need the shade model and engine built into your sever so that it can actually "see" all this stuff.

Two important details: Used correctly (as in once all the bugs are worked out) PBR should not really tax your current system much more than the current lighting model. In some instances, it should even be an improvement, Pbr is also goingto be an "all in" or all out" deal. If I am using actual PBR textures on everything, and you are looking at those objects with a non PBR viewer, all you will like see are gray textures.

I have to wonder, with so few people in OS even using Advances Lighting textures, will there be a real want for PBR lighting in OS? It is something I am used to, so I like it, but I am fairly new here. Does everyone think there will be a real desire to implement this in OS? Should be exciting.
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OpenSim 0.9.3.0 supports PBR. OSgrid's official sims, the Plazas, are all PBR-capable as has been proven. I've seen a picture made by Hicks Adder showing a working mirror at one of the Sandbox Plazas, and I suspect that beat-up sci-fi helmet on display at Lbsa Plaza to use PBR.

As far as textures go, both SL and OpenSim have a fallback: Every surface can have both a set of PBR textures and a set of traditional non-PBR/Blinn-Phong textures. The latter are used in non-PBR viewers, the former are used in PBR viewers. You only get grey surfaces if the traditional textures are missing.

In addition, OpenSim also has fallback textures for the ground. Second Life doesn't; it doesn't seem to need them. After all, two versions from now, the non-PBR versions of both the official viewer and Firestorm will no longer be allowed. OpenSim doesn't have this rule, and there are still people using Firestorm as old as 6.0.2 although it doesn't support BoM, and BoM has no viable fallback.

As for the demand for PBR, it will come. Just like BoM came. For now, there won't be much happening, what with how few places support it, how rough around the edges the first PBR Firestorm is, and how few people actually know what BoM is. It's similar to the spring of 2020. All places that ran on vanilla OpenSim had at least basic BoM support, but Firestorm 6.3.9 was so buggy that everyone stuck with Firestorm 6.0.2 with no BoM support. The only BoM content available were a few basically unknown Ruth 2.0 or RuthToo forks with basic BoM and, released in May, Roth2 v2 with scripted BoM which nobody would ever had heard of either if I hadn't peddled it.

Then, in July, came Athena 6 which most OpenSim users take for the first BoM body in OpenSim, in August came Adonis 4, both with very basic and actually incomplete BoM, and in autumn came Firestorm 6.4.13 which fixed Firestorm 6.3.9's show-stopper bug. Still, nobody really knew what BoM was, and even only few people stopped using skin appliers and actually started using BoM. But that teal "Free Bakes on Mesh" label became synonymous for "the newest hottest shit you can possibly put on your avatar". Still today, hardly anyone really fleshes BoM out, also because nobody dares to rip new layer clothes from SL because they'll be perceived as ugly, out-dated crap.

For the near future, I can see two things happen. One, at least one new Firestorm version irons out the rough edges of 7.1.9. (Sorry, no way back to having forward rendering without ALM.) Two, someone starts ripping shit-tons of PBR content from SL and offering it in their freebie store with a brand-new, custom PBR logo on it. Either that'll happen at iPleasure or Darkhearts, boosting either even more, or that'll happen on an entirely new sim which has the chance of becoming more popular than iPleasure and Darkhearts.

Either way, while still nobody will know what it actually means, PBR will replace EvoX as the label for the new hotness, just like EvoX replaced BoM. Also, nobody will really flesh PBR out because, just like now, nobody will be bothered to install light sources anywhere on their sims.
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Thank you so much! If there was a "love" option I would have selected that instead of "like". That is the most concise and informed assessment is have seen from the OS side of PBR. I also think your forecast about how it will reach here is spot on. As I said in another post. It will not happen tomorrow, nor should it, but it will happen. I for one think that is a good thing. There is no reason on earth that something as goofy as 3DXChat should have better graphics AND better framerates than OS. One question I have for you is about "Exposure". If I am running a grid on 0.9.3.0 and I log in with a PBR capable viewer, isn't everything going to look different because of the color setting, regardless of if I have PBR textures anywhere or not? Thanks again for the info and for putting it in language even I can understand =)
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Everything looks different in a PBR-enabled viewer, even if you should manage to visit a grid that still runs a long-dead fork that's largely on the same level as 0.8.0.0 or so. You'll always have a higher contrast, more vivid colours and shiny surfaces actually reflecting something.

The only server-side change is the support for PBR textures in content. Everything else from actually rendering PBR textures to lighting to colour handling (high dynamic range!) is done viewer-side.
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Thank you again, I am learning a bit with each reply! That is also in line with what I am hearing from a few in SL. In a PBR viewer, everything has that high contrast and vivid colors, so that is just going to be the world we live in for a bit. Ca you tell me what textures the new viewer supports/needs? Specual and Normal maps I am sure of obviously. And likely and Ambient Occlusion map? Is there more than those three texture layers?
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To my mind the problem with PBR is the fact that so many of the discussions I've seen on it say that non-PBR content is impacted by the PBR viewers. The most common comment is that with a PBR viewer the colors of non-PBR content are much more 'bold'. Either way ... non-PBR content and PBR content don't mix well, by all accounts. I don't know if that's LL's implementation of PBR, or if it's inevitable, but as someone who came to OS to preserve the things I cherish when SL succumbs to mismanagement ... my region will always be pre-PBR and as such I won't be updating viewers ever.
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While I can't agree that adapting PBR is in any way "mismanagement "as much as it is just updating to an industry standard to maintain functionality, It is my understanding also that PBR would affect how you everything, be it PBR texture or not. You are changing how light works. As I understand it, PBR is like getting a new Sun. It is going to react with everything. Your Windlight will effect the colors of everything differently. Your water will effect the colors of everything differently. That is called "Exposure"
https://medium.com/@shinsoj/the-diary-of-ta-lighting-expos...

Is should be noted that this is not something that LL just threw out with no notice. LL has been moving towards this and saying so since it began using specular maps almost six years ago. They are trying hard to get on par with Unreal Engine and Unity, which are the basic standards now
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I wasn't actually referring to PBR as mismanagement. I was talking about all the other stuff ... redirecting most of their dev talent and blowing a fortune on Sansar, that sort of thing. :)

Beyond that ... one of the purposes of my region (still a WIP and not open the public after all these years lol) is the preservation of wonderful things I found in SL. Builds and outfits which achieved near-miracles given the limitations of prims, sculpties and system bodies ... many of which have been lost to time. I am not adverse to moving forward by any means, but I will not embrace anything with detracts from the wonders that I've gone to great lengths to preserve. And that's important (to me at least) because a lot of what I've preserved is from creators long gone from SL. I still, to this day, remember the sense of wonder and glory I felt when I first arrived in SL ... and awe at what some creators achieved. I guess my region is a testament to that.
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Windlight has been dead and gone since OpenSim 0.9.2.2 and Firestorm 6.6.3, replaced with EEP. You can still get boxes containing the old Windlight presets converted to EEP, but that isn't Windlight proper. So in order to preserve Windlight, you'll have to stick to OpenSim 0.9.2.1 at best, maybe manually backport security patches, and Firestorm 6.5.6.

The main difference between PBR content and pre-PBR content is/will be that the colours of PBR content are more subdued. Pre-PBR content has almost cartoonish colours to equal pre-PBR viewers' low-contrast rendering of everything. However, I can see non-PBR content in SL being upgraded for PBR viewers with more subdued colours even if it doesn't get PBR textures.

Other differences will be more glaring. I mean, a lot of pre-PBR content was made to look good on toasters with absolute minimum graphics settings. Plenty of it was ripped and taken to OpenSim. You can see it everywhere: baked-on shadows, baked-on highlights, baked-on reflections/shininess and not even the faintest trace of Blinn-Phong. Putting such content next to PBR content on a PBR-enabled sim will look inconsistent, but then again, so is putting it next to content with Blinn-Phong already now. Think old prim kitchen appliances next to Arcadia's Espresso Machine.

And look around typical sims here in OpenSim. Many sim builders have no problems plopping down ripped SL mesh buildings with baked-on everything right next to simple prim buildings that look like 2007 because they're even set to full bright, thus circumventing the shaders.
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I have to comment on what a great item this is, and compliment Val for her great customer service. I had a few question on making sure I setup the item correctly, and Val not only responded but came over and walked me through the setup process (which is fairly simple) step by step. Great product, does exactly what is supposed to and we are lucky to have someone like Val creating things for us here in OS.
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I know where mine is going =)
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heheheeh im sure i know it too ;-)
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As a noob resident, I am giving this a big heart! So much to leanr and it always seems that with every one answer I find, I then have two more questions..lol
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This is all under construction at the moment, but we've opened it up so folks can see what we're doing. In the meantime if you have questions, please do not hesitate to ask, someone will do their best to help.
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Being able to run something like that on only 4gb is really great. I would love to be able to connect an NPC to AI LLM so that they can explain the story of Avedon Park. Also, nice watch. I miss watches.
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When I look at this picture, I can almost hear the water and the wind. Very pretty
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Awesome! Well done Chi!
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Nope, women were not allowed to vote in most of ancient Greece, including in Athens. Nor could they own land on their own. Aristotle claimed women were incapable of making important decisions themselves. Athenian woman had little opportunity in economic and legal life, including politics. The big exception was Sparta. That was a whole different show. Women could not only vote and hold office and go to court, but held immense power all of their own.
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To add more detail to your excellent comment...

The disadvantage of being female in ancient Athena began at birth. The Athenians would, at times, kill their kids. “Historians believe that girls were at a higher risk of infanticide because of their gender, as most families preferred to have at least one healthy boy who could inherit their lands and fortune”.

So, that sucks.

Girls “did not receive any formal education because it was focused exclusively on boys. Boys were educated to play a role in the political and military life of the city-state of Athens. Due to this, the education of girls and women was seen as useless.”

But girls did learn how to cook, clean, and sew! So, that’s something. The thing is that “...the role of women was to marry and have children. Ensuring that the family continues on was the parents’ main concern, especially fathers, as they would not want the family fortune to disappear. To secure their legacy, fourteen-year-old girls would be married to older men usually chosen by their fathers or another male relative. Thus, girls would not choose their husbands nor have any influence over the matter”.
https://www.thecollector.com/athenian-women-in-ancient-gre...

But they could vote, right? Wrong. The fact is that, in Athens. women had no independent existence in the eyes of the law, leading Plato to propose that women should be given the same education as men, the same access to the law courts, the same rights to own and inherit property, to hold public office, to compete in athletics and to live and work as equals to men.

Didn’t happen.
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and remember, that 75+ is just less than half of the people actually here and scrolling through the pages. Their are almost three times that, OSW just likes to pretend they do not exist. So technically, many of the largest grid owners with accounts here, would not have a vote.
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I agree with you on the hysterics, but maybe creating an elitist class system where only X gets a vote is not the best answer. it certainly did not end well for the Greeks.
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Or for Socrates.
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Honestly, why the need to collect people's IP addresses? What exactly are you up to Cyber? Lately you seem more interested in griefing tools than being helpful. So disappointed.
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contraire mon frere! This is an ANTI-greifing tool. Now if someone comes to your sim named mark, and mark makes you mad and you ban him, and he comes back as bill, and you see it's the same exact IP, you can ban bill along with Mark. Do keep in mind this information is ALREADY AVAILABLE in the console. This radar just makes it so you can see it instantly without having to switch over to the console. Also keep in mind that the function that does this is no special coding trick at all. It's a standard LSL function built into the LSL programming language. The reason the designers of opensimulator included this function in the code is to PREVENT greifers from constantly returning and harassing the sim owner.
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I believe you mean "Ma sœur" and you kind of proved my point. Yes, the address is already available in the console. Yes, I can look up anyone's IP when they listen to me DJ, but I don't. I have no need. Yes, it can be a standard LSL function. No, there is no reason make something that deliberately scrapes them up and displays them for you. :P

Using you analogy, If I ban Mark and he comes back as Bill and does nothing, then what do I care? If Bill is a problem, I ban Bill. Differant philosophies I guess.
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Sometimes people don't play fair. If you ban Mark, and he is mad, and comes back as bill, sometimes he won't attack you. Instead Bill will start small problems with several of your friends. Maybe spreading little lies, that eventually avalanche into a death trap. If Bill is smart & evil, He may use many nefarious techniques to bring your grid crashing down around you. Yes. There are people like that. It's unfortunate. But in many cases people who can program can do things and you won't even know it is them doing it. It's sad they use their IQ for evil stuff like this, but they do. It's how they get their kicks. My approach is to nip-it-in-the-bud. Your approach is to let it fester, and hope they are not an evil hacker type who gets their kicks being 'smarter-than-the-grid-owner'. To each their own. Sometimes they even use social engineering. Example: Bill comes back as David and picks on your friend Sara. Then comes back as Sam and picks on your friend Sara again. Then comes back as Jeff and picks on Sara again. Sara is constantly complaining to you, and from your perspective it begins to look like Sara is the problem. But that is what Bill wants you to think. Bill can also play the Let's You and Him fight game. Maybe Bill decides you are too intuitive, so Bill starts fights between Sara and your other friend John. See what I mean?
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Honest? No. I deal with each avitar as each avitar. I got about halfway through that paragraph, got bored about when Sara showed up, and went and made Ice coffee. You are certainly brilliant and a great creator. (and you pack a mean thong) I just think your talents are better spent. So we will justagree to disagree =)
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Very flawed logic. Making someone's IP public for no other reason than to do it is stupid and reckless, for numerous reasons. And yes, many can use a VPN and if you use the internet at all, you should use one, but the idea that Bob needs to go out and geta VPN just to enjoy OS because Joe Blow is collecting IP addresses is an unnecessary burden on Bob.
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Well you are not making it public though are you? The radar only tells it to the sim owner. Which the sim owner can already see it by looking in the console. This just makes it so you don't have to keep switching over to the console every time somebody new teleports in, especially handy if you have a greifer.
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My logic is completely sound. The point is that the function to retrieve an IP address is not hacking, it's not malicious, it's simply a part of SL/OS. If you don't like your IP being visible, get a VPN. Otherwise, I can see your IP, both from an LSL scripting standpoint, as well as in the server logs. It's not difficult to understand, but apparently difficult to comprehend for some.
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It is not difficult to comprehend, but you are arguing apples when I am speaking of oranges. When I DJ, I can very easily look at my logs and see the IP and location of every person that listened, but I don't. Why would I? There is NOTHING that is "simply a part of SL/OS" that would require me to look at them. And yes, it is part of LSL scripting in some instances. Both our examples are just processes that collect an IP as part of the process to do something else. That is very different than building something designed SPECIFICALLY to collect them. Just because it is easy, does not always mean you SHOULD. (And as mentioned already, VPN's don't always work and are not always an option.)
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The let's give a real example of why you WOULD want someone's IP address. If some asshat on here decides to drop into my SIM and proceeds to wreak havock, cause drama, spam me with messages, etc., I can now ban their IP address from accessing my server. Without it, I'm banning alts all day and night. And, to keep this discussion clear, this doesn't "collect" IP addresses, it displays them.
It seems to me the issue here is that everyone wants to point fingers, cry witch, and never consider that the consequences of their actions. A select few who WANT to use this to grief, quite simply and frankly, will do whatever the hell they want with the information to achieve their end goal. If you think this radar attachment is the only time your IP is being displayed publicly in SL, by all means, continue to live in your little bubble, but to accuse the creator of a scripted gadget as perpetuating, endorsing, or otherwise intending to affect the general hypergrid traveler in some way is just a sad cry for attention.
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VPN connections have not worked for me in past so it is not an option for me to anonymize my IP.
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It still doesn't matter. Your IP is ALWAYS displayed in the console of the grid owner.
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I'm sorry to hear that! VPNs can be finicky, especially if you have any type of networking modifications made to your router. If you're hosting a SIM and can't connect with a VPN, it's likely the VPN doesn't allow port forwarding. I use a paid version of Proton most of the time, or Mullvad if I'm not at home, both of which I recommend you give a shot if you've had negative experiences with your past VPN provider.
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I am using the free version of Proton to determine if I should get the paid version but have passed on it so far. The port forwarding might be a likely cause for the failure. Thx.
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I know! I could not tell if that was some sort of promotion, or if someone with Tourette syndrome was just randomly spitting out random filth.....which makes the random inclusion of "free skyboxes" kind of funny.
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Why do this? You are so much better than this.
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An amazing store and a beautiful sim. Worth a visit!
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awesome to see people come together like this! Great event!
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